What a mess. Working with what started as an '88 R4J. Wiring harness was crap so bought a used harness and a PGM II. Now I discover that the harness does not have a plug for the PGM II. Is that a different plug than for the PGM I? Can i just install a compatible plug or does the harness have to go with the same version of the PGM? In other words, go back to a PGM I (assuming the harness is in fact for an R4J and not some other model)?

If i do go back to PGM I, which carbs and which flywheel do i need?

PGM-I and PGM-II are totally different. There are also two different PGM-I harness types, so you need to identify which you need.

I certainly wouldn't recommend trying to modify a PGM-II harness to work with a PGM-I.
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Last edited by Andy on Tue Oct 13, 2020 7:44 am; edited 1 time in total

thanks as always Andy.

So i have two rotors, one is model 7MZ the other is 3MZ. I have a regulator marked SH57:-12 on the back and 2 sets of TA21A carburetors. Are all these compatible with a PGM II (not the 7MZ i'm guessing)? is there anything else besides the wiring harness that needs to be compatible to make this all work?

Can't help with R2/4J flywheel ID, but I suspect RobH will know. He'll probably be around soon.

TA21A, as I'm guessing you already know, are PGM-II carbs. They can probably be made to work, but honestly, you're in a real grey area and there's no support for the configuration. While the castings are all the same externally, the internal galleries differ in each variant, to correspond with the PGM fuelling/air correction. (PGM TA20A | PGM-II TA21A | PGM-III TA22/TA22B)

I'm sure I'm stating the obvious here, but if you're going to use the PGM-II, then you should fit the complete harness, flywheel, pickup coils, TA21 carbs, and air correction solenoids & plumbing etc., as it's all designed to work in harmony... which it does very well.

I guess there are three main questions to ask yourself...

1. How original do you want it?
2. Do you have more 88 or 89 components?
3. Which of the 88 or 89 components are in the best condition?

Ultimately, my advice would be to bite the bullet and sell off the PGM-II stuff and get it all back to original. Obviously you need to identify which harness version you have to ensure you collect to correct parts.
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Thanks Andy. Yes those are the questions I have asked myself. First one is easy. I don't care about originality, as this is a race/track bike only and i ended up having to buy amn MC28 engine from Japan so the originality ship has sailed. as for which i have the most of, well, I have the PGM II unit and matching carbs and have to assume all the carb attachments match. I think the regulator is compatible. I can get the wiring harness no problem. I have no idea what happened to the original R4J harness as the bike has been through a few hands, some of which were not too careful to keep it all together. Hopefully RobH can confirm the rotor but pretty sure the 3MZ came off the original R4J motor so it might not work. Not sure what you mean by the pickup coils. The alternator on the bike now is i believe from the MC28 engine since the R4J was in bad shape.so as of now i seem to have more PGM II components but have to confirm i can get any others i need.

so next questions: is the alternator coil an issue and if so, how to identify the correct one? and same question for the pickup coils?

The 87 and 88 flywheels are bigger than the 89-96 flywheels. All have different timing, so you would be advised to confirm you have an 89 flywheel.

The pickup (pulse) coils differ according to the large or small flywheel.

The stator shouldn't matter... they all output similar voltage, that's taken care of by the REG/REC.
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Looked at the parts list. By "alternator" i mean the stator. I see the pickup coils. Seems doubtful i have the PGM II compatible ones. Is there a way to identify them? Is there a workaround considering the bike is for track use only?

Thanks Andy, just saw your last message after posting my previous message. that is helpful.

Correction on the flywheels. One is 7MZ the other is 3PX, NOT 3MZ. The complete numbers on each are:
037000-2641 7MZ
037000-3322 3PX

Andy are you saying that the pickup coils for R4J and R5K are interchangeable as long as the flywheel is the correct size?
Also what is the timing issue with the flywheel/rotor? Just asking because I do have offset keys from Tyga which will advance the timing 1-4 degrees.

tleighbell wrote:
Correction on the flywheels. One is 7MZ the other is 3PX, NOT 3MZ. The complete numbers on each are:
037000-2641 7MZ
037000-3322 3PX

037000-2641 7MZ is MC21 (I just happen to have one here on my desk!)

tleighbell wrote:
Andy are you saying that the pickup coils for R4J and R5K are interchangeable as long as the flywheel is the correct size?

No. The pickup coils are different. They could possibly be modified to fit though. You'd be better off with the correct parts though, as their positioning from the flywheel is pretty critical.

tleighbell wrote:
Also what is the timing issue with the flywheel/rotor? Just asking because I do have offset keys from Tyga which will advance the timing 1-4 degrees.

That you'll have to figure out on the dyno. I've never bothered with offset keys myself.
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Thanks yet again Andy.

So in the hope someone can identify the pickup coils i have, mine have no identifying marks except the word/letters TET (or TEI) Japan. There is a white 4 pin female connector. The wires are blue, yellow, white with blue stripe, white with yellow stripe.

Thanks yet again Andy.

So in the hope someone can identify the pickup coils i have, mine have no identifying marks except the word/letters TET (or TEI) Japan. There is a white 4 pin female connector. The wires are blue, yellow, white with blue stripe, white with yellow stripe.

whoops!

tleighbell wrote:
So in the hope someone can identify the pickup coils i have, mine have no identifying marks except the word/letters TET (or TEI) Japan. There is a white 4 pin female connector. The wires are blue, yellow, white with blue stripe, white with yellow stripe.

If memory serves me correctly, the 89-96 pickups have a protruding sensor, and the 87-88 pickups have a flush sensor. If you try to fit later pickups with an early [larger] flywheel, the sensors hit the flywheel.
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Early type:


Late type:


(Off the top of my head! Best to confirm, just to be sure!)
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